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March 29, 2016
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Hi guys,
I would like to get some help on a hand I played in a 230 dollar tourney.
Blinds 3-6k 1k ante
UTG1 (170k) raises to 18k
hero 10 10 (190k) calls
BTN (90k) All in
UTG1 Reshoves and I feel like I have to fold. The information I had on the UTG1 is from a hand he played earlier where he just called a raise in position with AK and he didn’t 3 bet it and he checked raised all in on a gutshot flop and got there. His 4bet shove though seemed very strong and the BTN was folding for 20mins before he went all in.
My question is do I 3bet pre and if he jams I fold or is the way I played it OK.
February 20, 2015
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I know you’re between UTG+1 and the button, but specifically where? Also, how many people are in the hand? The reason I ask is because with antes that large I’m thinking about 3-bet shoving here if I’m in later position. You could also 3-bet to like 40K, but now your stack is getting pretty awkward. It depends on how good you are post-flop as well as what reads you have on the other players.
March 29, 2016
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I was in the CO. UTG+1 opened and it folded to me where i flated. When i went over the hand i thought a 3-bet would look really strong and it might have been the best line to take like you suggested. If i 3 bet to 40-50k then BTN would have went all in with AK and UTG+1 would fold i think. I am priced in to call and i win another 120Kish as the board run Jack high.
Now what if i 3 bet to 40-50k and BTN goes all in and then UTG+1 reshoves. His UTG+1 range to take this line is crashing mine. Do i fold?
May 30, 2012
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I got more questions……. How many players left? Are you in the money? These are important questions for us to give you a good answer. Is this a shallow tourney? or are you all kinda short at time point?
How do you see each player……??? The BTN shove guy should be kinda strong regardless, depending on what kinda of player he is and the original raiser.
March 29, 2016
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Blinds 3-6k 1k ante
UTG1 (170k)
hero 10 10 (190k)
BTN (90k)
There were 32 players left at the time of the hand and 19 places get paid. I was the biggest stack on the table at the time and the second biggest was the UTG+1 everybody else was pretty shallow. BTN would never make a move there light and he was pretty tight for the whole time i saw him play.
May 30, 2012
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Then it’s a insta FOLD………… This is a quick daily tourney of sorts. You could have the best hand, but since you are the CL’er and getting close to money. I don’t chance it. You could be flipping for it against AQ 99 or be dominated by JJ-AA……… Just fold esp since you just flatted.
May 30, 2012
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*If you would have 3bet to 40kish PRE…… btn jams and OR folds, You have to call.
If u 3bet pre, Btn jams, and O.R. reshoves, I fold…….. he should always have you bet with AK or JJ-AA……
Because of the type of tourney you are playing, I don’t mind your flat w/ TT because you would have to call the BTN jam. But in this type of tourney and the skill of the players, you might have they both crushed. You have to always take in to account the skill level of the players, the buyin, style of players…….
TPE Pro
December 6, 2012
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Pretty troubling that this thread has been open for 5 days and no one has yet attempted an EV calc…
May 2, 2016
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Okay, SO, just to please all y’all and for my own damn practice, I’ve been performing an equity calculation for this hand.
I’ll start by saying we’ll take the hand as played. Whether or not you should perform different action preflop remains to be seen (although I don’t seen anything particularly wrong with the preflop play). For the first part, we assume you flat, and when the button shoves the UTG raiser folds. Action is on you.
Pot: 18k (blinds + antes) + 18k (UTG raiser) + 18k (you) + 90k (button shove) = 144k. And to you it’s 72k more, or exactly half the pot.
According to Equilab, your equity with 10 10 against JUST AJs+, AQo+, and 88+ (which I don’t think is that bad of a range for the button shove) is 47.87%.
0.4787*144 = 68.93k when we call and win.
0.5213*72 = -37.53k when we call and lose.
Therefore, calling here is better than a 31k profit on the EV side of things. And we could even tighten up the button range a little more, and it’s still profitable. At TT+, AQs+, and AKo you have 35.84%.
0.3584*144 = 51.61k when we call and win.
0.6416*72 = -46.1952 when we call and lose.
Which leaves us with an EV of + 5.415, or +5,415 (over half a BB). And that second range I gave for the button is way too tight IMHO.
Now, let us give the button jammer the first range of 88+, AJs+, AQo+, and let’s say UTG+1 jams over the top. Let;s give him an ultra tight range, much like the second range we gave the button jammer. How about we take out TT and make it JJ+, AQs+, and AKo.
Now, the main pot will have 216k before your decision, and another 80k in the side.
Against both players you have 26.49% equity, so your share of the main pot is
0.2649*216 = 57.22k
And you lose
0.7351*72 = -52.93k. Which is still a plus EV in the main, by 4,290 (4.29) chips.
In the side, you have 35.51% equity, and there’s a total of 80k in the side before your call, so
0.3551*80 = 28.41k
and
0.6449*80 = -51.60k giving you a -23.19k EV in the side.
Together its an EV of -18.9k, making this a clear fold.
HOWEVER, let’s pretend (one more) that you give your UTG reshover the SAME range (or so) as our button shover; 88+, AQo+, and AJs+ (maybe a little loose, but not that far off some players).
You now have 30.99% equity against both players, so in the main pot
0.3099*216 = 66.94k
and
0.6901*72 = 49.69k which is a difference of 17.25k. And in the side
0.4787*80 = 38.3k and
0.5213*80 = 41.7k which is a difference of -3.4k. Together, that brings the EV of this decision to a staggering POSITIVE 13.85k, or over 1.5 BBs.
SO, to sum up, in MY opinion this is a pretty clear call against pretty much any button range assuming UTG folds. If UTG calls or reships, then you need to think very carefully about other factors like the UTG range. In the long run, though, this may still be a profitable call. You’re kicking yourself when you call and see JJ and QQ, but also when you fold and see AK and AK. It’s a tough spot, for sure, but these close spots come down to a simple matter in my mind; do you want to win? I don;t use that question as the basis for all my decisions, but sometimes it can help between two decisions fractions of a percentage apart.
Hope I helped and excuse my errors, this is my first EV calculation that I’ve taken the time to write out.
December 30, 2015
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Nice run-through!
March 29, 2016
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Nice work there buddy
and thank you for making this spot super clear for me! I appreciate your work and i have to start doing EV calculations myself to better understand future spots.
When i folded the reshove, the button showed AK and the UTG+1 showed AQ so i was really kicking myself 🙁
Being a live tournament player only, i made a promise to myself to write down every single hand i play with as much detail i can remember so i can come back and analyze my game.
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